Panic Attacks: Why They Happen and How to Tame Them

We talk honestly about panic attacks, what they feel like in the body, and why the “afterburn” can linger long after the peak passes. We share practical, evidence-based tools to calm symptoms, identify triggers, and know when it’s time to get professional help.
• how panic attacks show up physically and why they feel so scary 
• the difference between a brief panic spike and hours of nervous system afterburn 
• how the mind mislabels normal body shifts as danger 
• why starting with body regulation beats forced deep breathing 
• using cold exposure like ice packs and cold drinks to slow the spiral 
• CBT as the standard of care plus trigger logs and psychoeducation 
• distress tolerance practice to get comfortable with discomfort 
• exposure therapy for flying anxiety and other fear cues 
• where to start if you need help quickly, including primary care 

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:13

Yeah, I'm on a struggle bus today. Just gotta own it whenever you are.

SPEAKER_00 0:17

It's true. And some like today started off so strong, and now I just feel like a chicken with my head cut off. Then you remember you're like, gosh, things could always be 1,000 times worse than they are.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

I appreciate that because, like we were saying beforehand, I was like, I have literally all of the energy in the world, but zero concentration right now. They make meds for that, you know.

Panic Attacks Return And Why

SPEAKER_00 0:39

Very helpful ones. Most of the time I'm really functional. Today's not one of those days. There's just not enough hours in the day. That's the problem. And I'm so done with February. It's already a shitty month, in my opinion. The weather sucks. It's the month my dad died. It's the month my good friend died. Um, I just like am always like in a funk when February rolls around. And um, just to kind of preview today's topic, we're gonna touch on I had some resurface of the panic attacks last month. I will say, before we sort of get into it, is I feel so grateful that I don't worry about them coming back with the same frequency as I had them in 2020. But a good reminder that it can always resurface and come and come back.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

Talk about disrupting function for long periods of time.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

Yeah. I mean, that's where the disorder comes in, right? We're gonna lean on your uh expertise in this area. I know people are like, aren't you both psychologists? Very different types of psychologists. Mine is school-based, education-based, uh, working with students with disabilities and how we can improve their outcomes. Um, whereas Sarah is more of what people think of when they think psychologist of uh counseling and you know, diagnosis, treatment, those types of things.

Symptoms And The Afterburn Effect

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Yes. So I am a clinical and health psychologist, still licensed within my field that I worked in was a very uh it was always an integrated setting. So I had medical physicians right next to me the entire time. This whole talk is just basically going to be psychoeducation to hopefully explain what panic attacks are, if you are experiencing them, what um you can do to have access to care, what the standards of care actually are with panic attacks in particular. It was always helpful to have the physician there. So we could really see the validity of doing some of the exercises that we talk about because we could see them biometrically as well.

SPEAKER_00 2:31

Um for me, I'll just reiterate sort of like what that what I experience physiology physically. I'm trying to use big words, already messing them up. Um physically, for me, the way I know now know that I'm having a panic attack is my heart starts to race. Usually that's above 180 uh beats per minute. Um, I start sweating profusely. I feel like I can't breathe. Obviously, I can because I'm surviving them, but in the moment, it feels like you can't take a deep breath, or at least that's what it feels like to me. Um, like I'm actually like can't get enough oxygen in my brain. Um, it's really like things start swirling. I have a hard time focusing. Um, then you start to wonder like, am I actually having some other type of medical emergency? Like those thoughts tend to go through my head once it starts. So would you say, based off what I just told you, that those are pretty typical types of symptoms for panic attacks?

Panic Attacks Versus Real Danger

SPEAKER_01 3:33

Yes, for panic attacks, that is a typical symptom. Nausea can also be um a piece of the puzzle as well, because you are getting your entire sympathetic nervous system engaged. Whether you know it or not, everything is kicking into gear. And so that then can cause later on disruption. So the panic attack itself only is going to last a few minutes, but it's the afterburn that continues to feel like it lasts for hours or days. So people will come in and be like, I've been having a panic attack for 24 hours. No, you probably only had like one or two, but it's the like I'm using the word afterburn that it still has your physiological system revved up to the point where it has had a difficult time to resettle. And again, that does include your digestive system. That includes um, you know, your respiratory, the exhaustion that can kind of feel off after the fact. And so it still feels like that you were almost like charged, but have nothing, no place to go. And so again, it is a very um kind of paralyzing position to find yourself in. And so, yes, and diagnostically, whenever we talk about this, there's actually panic disorder and then there are panic attacks. And panic attacks are a specifier. So within our realm of work, we can add that specifier to any other type of diagnosis. So you can have major depressive disorder with panic attacks, you could have PTSD, you know, uh with panic attacks, and or you could just have panic disorder in and of itself. And so diagnostically, there are different things that um we have to kind of look at as psychologists because that does determine what our treatment plan is going to be for that specific patient in mind. And so that's kind of a wraparound answer for yes, and here's the other things that kind of go along with it.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Yes, and right. And nobody has the same symptoms. I'm gonna assume everybody kind of experiences things differently. But I love the distinction you made of like the actual panic attack is only lasting a few minutes, but the afterburn effects, and I think that's what what I think back to, like when I would spend like an hour, you know, like you're right, you do sort of like start to recover a little bit, but it's that like physically you're so exhausted from what your body just went through that, you know, I might lay on the floor for 30 minutes after one just because I couldn't get myself back up and get myself together. And I'm talking about when they were happening like, you know, several times a day, um, it felt like they were lasting forever, you know, because you were just like constantly exhausted from it. Um, but in this case, you're right. It was just a few minutes. And then once, you know, I started some of that self-talk of like, you know, your nervous system is dysregulated, like really talking yourself through that instead of being afraid of it, get curious about it. Think like, okay, your nervous system is dysregulated, like your alarm bells are going off. And then I could sort of like work through that of like, yeah, your your alarm bells are going off because you're worried that your kid is like having a major, you know, emergency, medical emergency right now. So the that's a very normal kind of response that your body is like alarmed, right? Which leads me to my next question. Like, are they sometimes an appropriate response? Let's say you were in a car accident, right? And your car flipped. Do people then sometimes have panic attacks immediately following like some sort of tragic thing? Or is it always kind of like a delayed thing?

SPEAKER_01 7:09

The beauty of our evolutionary brain is that whenever we are in a true, honest panic attacks, like panic situation, like what you're talking about, we're able to function. And if you even listen to first responders, people who have survived these different types of things, you're able to respond in those situations because your true brain, um, the one that is actually supposed to respond in those situations, is intact and in gear. So you're gonna have the same exact symptoms that you are having when having a panic attack, so to speak, but because of the situational context in your mind is different because of, again, the situation, you're not going there. So what we have to just what we have to work on distinguishing whenever we talk about this is that um our mind and our brain, our body and our brain are combined. It's not one just floating around without the other. But in the case of a panic attack, what happens is basically our mind recognizes physiological changes within our body that may be normative. So, for example, it is a hundred percent normative for you in your situation to be concerned about your child, considering that everything was happening. And if you look at the situation just as it was, it was a period of instability, which again already gets like if we think about ourselves as a pot on an oven or on a stove, you're already kind of at a low boil. Right. This starts to happen, and now we've kicked it up a notch. But then where our mind intervenes without us even knowing it is what starts the panic process. So your mind was already sitting there wondering what to do about your daughter being sick, your husband's out of town, all of these things, which again is kind of like a ghost snail cooking in the kitchen, we're turning up the fire, but it's your body that is responding first instead of your brain. So they have this weird kind of like trick that they play on each other. And so that's where um so many times when people are having a panic attack, they end up in an ER, an urgent care, or hospital. And it's because of that physiological process that then our mind jumps onto and associates it with fear and anxiety, which is a hundred percent not necessary, and nor does that happen in a true crisis situation. Okay. Yeah. But your body can learn that. It can learn that and then happen again. So if that if you do have a crisis situation, your body experiences that and learns it from that, then the next time, again, your body is learning 24-7 without your mind knowing it, and your mind is also playing tricks on your body without the two of them. It's like they're backstabbing bus besties. Okay, they're not working together all the time here. What we're trying to do is to get them yoked and integrated. Um, but they again, they're backstabbing besties and they're not always working on the same team.

Reset The Body Before Mind

SPEAKER_00 10:03

Yeah, and I, you know what, that makes a lot of sense because if you think about when we meditate, right? A lot of times if you do guided meditations, they'll say, not to just like take a deep breath, because we do tend to say that a lot. Like if you're nervous, stressed, take a deep breath. It's not just about taking that breath, but really like training your brain to focus on that breath so that you're paying attention to the inhale and the exhale. You're not just going through the motions, but you're kind of connecting your brain to that. So what you're saying is making a lot of sense to me, and that they're disconnected, right, when you're in a sense of panic. But if you can regulate and get the focus, get your brain to focus on your breath, then for me, that does tend to have a positive impact. Like I won't say that, you know, that it's going to fix everything. And we're not here for a treatment plan. We are here to give you some tools and some tricks that that have worked in our situations or that we're familiar with. But it does if if you can get into some sort of meditation practice. To me, it is like experiencing those two panic attacks was just reaffirming that my meditation practice is so worth it. There are days I don't feel like doing it, but it really is a muscle that I have strengthened over the last several years that can be used now as a tool. You can't just like try to meditate when you're experiencing discomfort. Like it really needs to be a muscle that you have built over time.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

Yes. And again, you might still have the um experience, but it's not going to be, you know, it might be a flame instead of a wildfire that is like taking off. So with that, too, and just from like a basic treatment perspective, if you find yourself experiencing these things, seeing a CBT, a cognitive behavioral um retrained uh psychologist is what the actual like standard of care kind of is for this. Um, with that being the case, you know, the first thing that we focus on is psychoeducation. We want a person to understand their condition because understanding takes away, again, the fear and anxiety. So we're gonna talk about all of it. We're gonna talk about what it is, we're gonna talk about identifying different types of triggers, which can be um the way I try to remember it is like the T's. So it can be um, and these sound crazy, but you're gonna have to follow me on them. Transitions. So, like times of unsteadiness, you know, whenever your life is just a little bit um has a little bit more uncertainty, then that can be it. Uh, so transitions. And it can also be getting up in the morning, going to bed at night, um, getting in and out of your car. Anytime you're in a transitional state, again, from a from a more physiological, again, health kind of side of things, your body is at a point of shifting homeostasis. And homeostasis' job is always to rem maintain some level of consistency. And so when going between these different states, you are actually throwing your body in a period of inconsistency. It'll resettle, but you have to give it time and awareness to do so. We don't often think about it, which is the beauty. And again, the curse of this big brain that we have now is that now it starts to think. Um, and so transitions are one, temperature changes are another. And so a lot of times people will sit there and say, you know, um, I notice that I have a panic attack every time I go into Walmart. Now, Walmart, I get it. Definitely from a situational standpoint, but also generally speaking, whenever you're going into it, you're maybe getting blasted by the freezer section or uh, you know, by the produce at some of these places. And so again, your body is now happening to regulate itself and walking into that environment, plus with all of this other kind of stimulus that takes place.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

I would think also when you get really hot for me, like like if I'm on a plane and there's no AC and I'm in this confined space and I've got layers on, I am ripping my clothes off because, like you're saying, like that change in temperature, like it it automatically I can feel it start to bubble, right? I don't know. I I think of like getting super hot for me as like a I'm gonna lose that 100%.

SPEAKER_01 14:18

But again, it's because your body is struggling to maintain its sense of balance. It's not because this is messed up at that point of time, right? Again, these two are feuding besties, and so it's gonna make you think that that's the case. Right. So, with that being said, the quickest and the best way to actually, you know, stop a panic attack in its tracks um is with ice. And again, this sounds a hundred percent silly, but there's so much proof of this in our environment. There's real research that kind of proves this on another standpoint, but it's because the experience of something cold, especially whenever put on your chest, automatically makes you take that slow, long, deep breath. So I'll have many patients that used to come in my office, be like, you know, I've tried that deep breathing stuff, it doesn't work, like all of this stuff. And I'm like, correct. And that's because we haven't got your body to settle down before we try to talk your mind into doing something. So even if, like with a practice, I know that if I take these slow, long, deep breaths, I'm still going to struggle to get that slow, long, deep breath in because I haven't done anything about this first. So you have to go through the body to get through the mind. Period. Your body is always going to be your gateway into freeing your mind. If you are not moving your body, if you're not doing things to assist your body in this process, you will be stuck in this hill. And that is probably one of the worst ones to be stuck in. So ice.

SPEAKER_00 15:50

That's such a great tip. And I didn't think of it that night when I was going through that. But what I did do, I'm like, okay, I didn't put, and I've done that before. I've definitely gone and put like an ice pack on my chest. It is very helpful if you feel just like some nervous energy coming on. But I did go lay on the bathroom floor both times, which is like ice cold. You know, that was just like instinctive. It's what I do whenever I start to sweat profusely, like, you know, when I'm just not feeling well, that's like my go-to. And so maybe like, you know, that like my body was like craving that like instant shock of like cold.

SPEAKER_01 16:27

Yeah. Your body knows what you need before your mind will allow you to see it. Again, they're not communicating, they like to be at feud, but look like they're not. And so it is the best thing. Quick showers. I used to have some patients that would then start to take like a cold thermal into a store and they could hold on to it if they were having like a dinner with friends and notice the sensation coming over them, holding on to some ice water at the table. I mean, this doesn't have to be things that people know that you're doing, but can help you to kind of get to that resettlement point. Um, those freezer packs that you break and that they turn cold. Um, I had some patients that would experience them while driving and they would just do that to just kind of assist them in that moment. And then from there, we're able to talk through the process. We're able to identify what's going on in order to again break down that scary monster that's had hiding underneath the bed.

unknown 17:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:27

And then once you're able to do that, then again, it builds that kind of base for things. Um, another treatment that has gained a lot of um, you know, again, evidence to support use within care and really helps a whole lot is that we want to induce those physical sensations so that way it helps um you to untangle or dismantle what your mind is telling you. Because a lot of times whenever we feel something physical, our mind then tells us that we can't handle it.

SPEAKER_00 17:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:57

And that's not true. Like when you're doing jumping jacks or running, your heart is elevated. It's supposed to be. You can handle it. So we're going to elevate your heart rate in order to feel that way. If your main symptom of a panic attack coming around is dizziness, guess what? We're going to spin you around in a chair for a little bit to show you that you can actually withstand this physical feeling. Yeah. So that way, whenever you're put in that position, again, you've got some training, so to speak, in order to kind of manage through it.

Distress Tolerance And Trigger Tracking

SPEAKER_00 18:32

And we've talked about this before as far as like um kind of grounding techniques, those types of things, but listening, like how many sounds can you name? How many different green things can you see? You know, just sort of like trying to trick your brain. But what I hear you saying is if you try to do these things while your body is still responding, you're not going to be able to shift your brain quite so easily. So would you like put an ice pack on your chest and then try one of these nervous system regulation techniques?

SPEAKER_01 19:04

100%. Yes. And I again, it's the it's not that, and I had patients that would tell me this all the time. I've tried doing X, Y, and Z and it didn't work. It's not that those things don't work, it's the order that you do them and that matters. So, you know, you you can't bake a cake before you have all your ingredients in the bowl. You know what I mean? Yeah. So we need to start with the basics first, and that is resetting the body. So that means ice. That means if you're having a panic attack, great, we're gonna have you do some jumping jacks. Like we're going to go ahead and rev this beast up so that way we can see how quick that you can actually handle it and come down. And so then what we want to do is after we kind of get the body, not to a point where it's all the way down to like zero, but to where it's not in that hyper-responsive state, then we're going to layer those other skills and tools on, you know, to help us out in those situations. And some of that is even, you know, distress tolerance skill building. And that is something I am the out of all the skills that I've probably ever learned, I have the most appreciation for distress tolerance because it is so globally applicable. Whether it is anger, um, anxiety responses, depression, it doesn't matter almost what the response is. And basically is that you are this doesn't mean you like it, but that you are willing to experience some level of discomfort knowing that you can overcome it. Yeah. Or that this too shall pass in a way. And those are, again, things we don't like to think about whenever we're in that, but it's doing distress tolerance work before you're in the fire, is what matters. And so that could be as simple as going out in the cold without a jacket. You're going to experience what it's like to feel cold before, you know what I mean, have a have an issue with it later or heat. You're going to learn how to tolerate heat. You're going to learn how to tolerate whatever the situation is. And you're going to be, you know, coaching yourself, I'm willing to experience this because it will eventually go away. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:12

Um, such a great point though, because the more you are the more that I've experienced a panic attacks, the more you do start to kind of tell yourself, like, this too shall pass. You've lived through this before. Um, yes, it's uncomfortable, but that like getting comfortable, being uncomfortable, part of that is you have to know what your triggers are. And and that I think sometimes can be hard to figure out. I think of it like whenever we do functional behavior assessments and for kids, um, we're trying to figure out why a behavior is occurring. We look at the and what we call the antecedents. So, like, what's the precursor to the behavior that sort of like trigger the behavior? Same thing, kind of that you're talking about. What are those triggers? And sometimes that's the hardest part is identifying the specific triggers. Do you have any tips for how you? Can go about that is that like keeping a log and reflecting after you've passed through the anxiety attack, you go back and reflect and say, okay, what happened right before this? Is that kind of similar, or what you would suggest?

SPEAKER_01 22:13

It's the same exact thing. We're just the behavior's anxiety for us. The behavior is a panic attack for us. And so we do want to go back and try to figure out, even, and this is where we don't negate the small things. Like we really want to acknowledge anything that could have served as a trigger within a period of time. And that doesn't have to be the most everything was perfect today, nothing was going on. Well, honey, that again, you're a pot on a stove, you know. You may have gotten used to boiling. And so it's just really working with somebody who's able to kind of go back through objectively and not just go through your day, but go through your week, you know, other experiences that might have been overshadowed, like I mean, the month of February, like you said. I mean, we could go back through that whole thing, but now just the idea that the month of February, our heat's going to be turned up a little bit more, right? Again, as a point of awareness. And so anything that we can do to identify a trigger takes away its power. And now that doesn't, you know, I'm well aware that I don't, that the boogeyman isn't there, but there's still a fear that gets associated with the thought. And so again, we're working on targeting that through this process too, through using other words to describe feelings or sensations, to recognizing that some physical sensations that we have that are associated with a behavior are normative for us in that situation. So for you, for example, when speaking in front of public, it is a hundred percent normative for you to feel that way. Right. And so if you didn't, it would almost be weird. And so that's the acknowledgement, you know, hey, this is how I'm supposed to feel because I'm doing something I'm not comfortable with. So this is fine. This is actually not something I should be concerned about. This is totally my normal. Right. Again, once we feel comfortable with that, then it's like, oh, okay, then everything's fine. If I don't feel this way, then what's happened?

SPEAKER_00 24:07

Right. And what are some of the, you know, and then I go through, okay, what am I going to do? First thing I always say when I get up, I still get really nervous talking in front of a big group of people. I just let the cat out of the bag right off the get rip because you know what? People look at me and smile, and right there, there's that instant human connection of like, yes, I might be presenting today, but we are all the same on the base level, right? I we all get nervous when we have to talk in front of people. I'm gonna trip over words. It is what it is, you know? And so kind of working through that can help you, you know, if you're just experiencing some like elevated anxiety. And like you said, using that word, you got to use it um, you know, judiciously. However, one another trigger, and we can kind of talk about this, one that I found, you know, way back when I was experiencing this and kind of going through a treatment plan was um lack of sleep. If I was not getting good quality sleep every night, and that's where like that hamster wheel started or the Ferris wheel of hell, you know, you would have, you know, panic attack and then not sleep well. And that it just like it became like this cyclical thing. And so is that a common trigger um for panic attacks as well?

Flying Anxiety And Exposure Therapy

SPEAKER_01 25:19

Yeah, everything goes back. Whenever we're wondering something, it always goes back to the body. Our mind is just going to tell us that it doesn't matter or that it's not that big of a deal. So being hungry can be a sign of a panic. You know what I mean? Could be a trick, could be a trigger. Yeah, overeating could be having something that your body doesn't agree with, being on a disruptive sleep schedule, not getting enough sleep because you're again, we're not taking care of ourselves from a physical standpoint or an illness can come into play and then serve as, you know, again, a trigger for this. But anything that happens to be a disruptor to the body or is a sign that we're not necessarily taking care of it is going to throw it off. And again, our mind is going to misinterpret that as being danger instead of an alert for self-care. So our alert system is kind of what's messed up. Our alert says something's wrong instead of this is something I can fix. And that's what we really have to pay attention to.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

Yeah. I um kind of going back to like normal things that kind of raise our stress. Um, a lot of people are afraid of flying. And this is something that I'm going through with with one of my children before we tend to fly quite a bit. And before flights, like it's escalated to throwing up and just like really getting worked up about it. Um, and you know the trigger, right? You're about to step on a plane where you have no control and you know, all the same things. We all have these thoughts. Or I think vast majority of people, when you step on a plane, you realize how little control you have and you know how terrifying that would be should something ever go wrong. And I have a friend who wrote a book and she talks about this in her book. She was been on the podcast, as a matter of fact. Um, but she writes in her book about the way that she handled that was that she just like started booking flights, like taking flights everywhere, um, so that she could kind of prove to herself that you're safe and that it's okay. Is that, you know, a a good a good way to go about it? Or do you have any tips for helping your child work through? Because what I notice is once their anxiety starts to elevate, guess what? So does mine. Because right, I'm very intuitive and and and connected and um to my kids. And so, you know, it is start I have I wouldn't say that I have a ton of flight anxiety, but of recent I have more. So any suggestions that you uh have, I can't really carry an ice pack around the um the airport with me. So anything else that you can suggest that might help in this case?

SPEAKER_01 28:14

So I mean, you could always stop and get some, like, I don't know, you know, a cold drink or whatever else. Um, with that, it's the feeling that it's not even the action we've associated with the plane or flying, kind of like how we talked about it is the feeling that is overwhelming that is not able to be processed. And so again, we have to put you in that feeling state and show you that you can process it. And so it's like we want to induce those same physiological symptoms that you're having associated with a plane, but it's not flying. You know, like you've been sick at your stomach before and had a stomach bug and you've lived. This is the same thing. And what I think you're talking about, like with Kate, um, exposure therapy is one of the most validated things. A lot of people don't like it because you're actually exposing yourself to the trigger, but we have to do that in order to show ourselves sometimes that we're okay. Now, the way in which we go about it, you know, we're not maybe necessarily going to book you on a thousand flights, but there when I was a resident, we um had a virtual reality flight simulator that we would do with patients. And so we would put them in this reclining chair, put the VR system on them, and you know, go through that whole like flight. We'd have a nice flight, we'd have a flight that was in a storm that was, you know, had turbulence, like all the things in order to kind of get somebody through it. Um, but the same thing, it's just it's the physical sensations that get labeled with an emotion that then get labeled onto an object or an activity. And so we have to show them that they can survive the physical to allow the other chains as part of that link to get broken. And when she was exposing herself to flying, it wasn't the flying that she was the target. It was the physical sensation that accompanied that that was the actual target that she was benefiting from because your body is going to get exhausted from getting worked up over something. Yeah, it does. That's survival, that's where our like lizard brain kind of comes into play. It's not going to continue to be scared of something forever. It won't allow it.

SPEAKER_00 30:26

Okay. Period.

SPEAKER_01 30:27

It's your mind that you really get on there with.

SPEAKER_00 30:30

I I like the way that you break that down in that it's the um the feeling that we then associate with that something specific. You know, in the moment, it's really hard, even if you're trained in this stuff. I don't know if you feel this way, but like it's really hard in the moment to pull the pull this out, this knowledge out, and be like, okay, remember, this is just, you know, you're just throwing spaghetti at the wall trying to make it stop. Um and I struggle with that sometimes. I'm just like, I, you know, I'm trying to like be comforting as a parent and like, you know, look, we've had seven flights with no turbulence. Like the majority of flights are not going to be that one experience that you had this summer. Um so I I like that. And I do I do think I can use that to explain that it really is the physical discomfort that they're afraid of, not the actual thing that they've assigned it to. Whatever that thing is, roller coasters. I mean, name name the thing, right? Whatever it is.

SPEAKER_01 31:34

Yeah. And I mean, just even this is in a different realm, but the same thing. Whenever I would work with um patients who were addicted, the number one thing it was is that they didn't want to get sick because whenever they were detoxing off of like opioids, so to speak, then you get really, really sick at your stomach. But guess what? It's not going to kill you. We would be talking about it and be like, you've had a stomach virus before. You know, like even in terms of a relapse prevention plan for them, it was like, you know, you just got over the norovirus. They are going to feel like they're dying, and they are not. So we need to recognize what's actually slowly killing them is the addiction, not the feeling of being sick at your stomach. Let's move past this. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:16

Right. Interesting though, um, when you think about it from that perspective. Like, you know, whether it's like weaning yourself off of a substance or anything, you you know, just in general, we don't like to feel discomfort. Hell, I don't like to go to the OBGYN. That shit hurts when they do a PAPSMER. Like, that is discomfort. But you, you know, it's like anything. You do it enough, you sort of learn how to breathe through it, get through it, like you go to a different place and space in your brain. I think women are probably better at that, I'm just guessing, because it seems like we have a lot of training and discomfort. Um, and so yeah, I mean, it really is about just kind of training yourself and your brain to deal with it. Um, and just to realize like this two shot pass. We say there's a reason all of these sayings became sayings, right?

Getting Help And Closing Notes

SPEAKER_01 33:11

Right, right. But it's the feuding besties, as long as we remember these things are, you know what I mean, kind of constantly feuding working against each other. Right. It's not so much that the tools don't work, it's the sequence that we use them in is what's most helpful. Boom. And so, you know, keep that kind of stuff in mind. Yeah, and then again, seek help, you know.

SPEAKER_00 33:34

Yeah, and if it, yeah, if it if it's something that, you know, if it's a one-off, it's happened, you know, maybe you can work through it with some of the things we've talked about. But if this is something that you're truly suffering from, don't wait. If you if you are experiencing recurrent panic attacks, um, it is probably best to seek some sort of help. Um, because you can, you can get to a point. I mean, I I've said this before. I looked at my husband and I was like, I would sooner die than live like this. This is no way to live. It's truly not. It is painful on another level. Um, and so if you are experiencing it, please reach out um and get help because it it can you can get through this. You can get to the other side, and there is help out there for everybody.

SPEAKER_01 34:22

Right. And I mean, just as a as an ongoing point with that, people are like, well, where do I go to get help? You can go to your primary care doctor as your first step. That's you know, I made sure that yeah, you they will be the first, oftentimes they're the quickest to get into, and they can serve as your entry point if you are unable to get into a more traditionally based mental health provider um in an amount of time that is satisfactory.

SPEAKER_00 34:48

I could talk to you about this all day. You're always helpful. You have so much knowledge um when it comes to anxiety and depression. And you know, I've I've talked to you about many things, but I feel like that is really um your niche. And and you know, I I love these kinds of topics. So thank you for sharing your wisdom with us today. We are not your doctors, so please, if you're experiencing any kind of disturbances, medical, mental, please reach out for help. This um is just meant to be informative and validating and uh a reminder that there is help and that we can all recover from any type of mental health disorders. I truly believe with the right treatment that we can overcome um these mental health issues. So uh check us out on our social media, y'all. Um I'm still not on socials, it's still Lent. Um, so two weeks strong, no social media. Feeling good, guys. Feeling good, killing it. We're so appreciative. Share with your friends, like, subscribe, do all the things. Check us out at the Liless Podcast or on our website, lilesspodcast.com. What else, Sarah? What am I missing?

SPEAKER_01 36:04

I think you hit it all.

SPEAKER_00 36:05

Yeah.

unknown 36:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

Nailed it all in the head. Nailed it. All right. Well, as we said before, so many hours in the day. So we're gonna get back to the grind. Until next week, y'all. Lilas. Love yes.